Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadence

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Callipygian
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Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadence

Post by Callipygian »

"The new sim seems to be the primary issue in this election period.

Imagine that NSF West is just finished, and it is the inaugural day to celebrate the new sim and allow people to buy properties there. There are 50 lots and 100 people, both old citizens and new people wanting to join CDS, lined up at the borders in Monastery and NSF waiting for the bell to rush in and buy properties -credit cards and Lindens in hand-.

What mechanism would you propose to guarantee the fair and equitable distribution of properties in the new sim?"

People often say that, in a democracy, decisions are made by a majority of the people. Of course, that is not true. Decisions are made by a majority of those who make themselves heard and who vote -- a very different thing.

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Timo Gufler
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Timo Gufler »

If we knew about the land rush beforehand, some kind of reservation queue would be fair. Otherwise drawing lots would be the best option. Our current citizens would be left without new land in the sim.

In both cases we should start building another new sim rapidly, to continue our expansion and to respond to the demand!

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Rosie Gray
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Rosie Gray »

Just so everyone is thinking about the map in the right way - NFS West would be the one that abutts NFS and Monastery, thus completing the rectangle of land. NFS EAST would be the one that adjoins only to NFS, and would be for extension of the city. :)

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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by cleopatraxigalia »

I think the way it has been done in the past has worked well. ....Most recently with LA and earlier with other sims.

We have had the chancellor take a list of names of current citizens who desired specific parcels. When the sim was opened, the parcel is set for sale to the current citizen who asked for the parcel. If there is more than one person asking for certain properties then that has to be dealt with fairly of course, and hopefully openly. The rest of the land would then be put on the open market. First come first serve. We are limited in how many parcels any of us own at any one time ( hopefully this is fully enforced ) and so, thankfully, no one person can go buy the entire sim or go over their 8 parcel limit. If the land is bought up so quickly that there is a waiting list after that .. well.. perhaps we go buy another sim really quickly, but honestly I think one sim will do us just fine.

******************************************************************

another thought:

As I keep whispering, the way to make our five , hopefully soon to be six sims go further is to lower the number of parcels each of us can hold at any given time. Imagine how many more active citizens we could have ! For no more financial risk. Granted, it would take a bit more time to manage things, but we should also have more volunteers and more people to do the work ! It would be a gradual increase (not like the instant one with the AA merger) All we have to do is did cut the number of parcels a person can hold .... I would suggest we do it by attrition. As far as I know only one person is currently technically imho is over the 8 parcel limit.( 0wning 8 parcels as an individual and some as a group). Anyone over a new limit we could set, lets say we make it 4 parcels, could not buy land and hold it for a person .. like pat did for rosie because it would technically be against the law. I would want there to be an exception made also to grandfather people in, lets say they own 6 now and we make the new rule 4... we can grandfather in the 6, but when they sell two or one they cannot replace the land. They have to keep to 4 after the two are sold or abandoned.

The truth isn't that we need to expand only because people want more land, I honestly think CDS NEEDS more active participating citizens in order for the government to work in a healthy way with no overlaps of power and duties. The EMs should not be part of the executive team and sit on the RA and in the SC at the same time imho for example. We need MORE people to do events and run meetings, and more to help with hippo. And build and be in the guild, more not less.... More people NEED to be involved. We need more volunteers to work in the government positions we have set up.. more for events and jobs.. Buying a new sim is ONE way to do that. I want to do that, too ! Lowering the number of parcels any one citizen can own, well, it also is a way of increasing the population... AND it can stop people from "holding land" so no one else can buy it too, if this number of parcels is enforced.

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Cadence Theas
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Cadence Theas »

I am going to answer my own question.

There is so much intrigue attached to the purchase of land in CDS with conspiracy theories flying around and all are implicated as recent postings in the forum show. At the same time, the idea of being the first to own a property to break in a new sim is also very attractive. It is a formula to produce a lot of rancor unless steps are taken to establish a one-time land purchase policy for the new sim that is fair and equitable.

The problem is the idea of prioritizing access to land purchase with some saying that current members have preference, and others suggesting that new and potential members should have it. Whatever of the two choices made will produce ill will in the group not selected preferentially. And it doesn’t seem fair to designate the leftovers to either the old members, or to the new ones.

I believe the only manner to ensure a fair and equitable access would be to establish a one-time lottery until the sim is full. After that of course the sim would follow whatever policy is in place for the rest of CDS. People wanting to buy a property could pre-register with the Chancellery to enter into the lottery. Following a free-market model for the opening of the sim would only benefit those who know how to use the system, and not everyone. A lottery, however, guarantees impartiality.

This means that the people lined up at the edge of the sim on the inaugural day, rather than racing at the bell to buy as many properties as they can, could just wander slowly through admiring the new sim waiting and hoping for their name to appear in the lottery.

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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Trebor Warcliffe »

I'd have to agree that the way it has been done in the past seems to be a good method. I don't feel I need to explain the method since Cleo did a good job of explaining it above. One topic that hasn't been brought to the table yet is the sale price of the parcels. Our current pricing, the last time I checked is L$1.50 per SQM for single prim parcels and L$3.00 per SQM for double prim parcels. I'm assuming NFS West will be a double prim sim so based on our current pricing a 512sqm parcel would be L$1,536. I don't feel it makes good economic sense to pay full price for a brand new sim when the used sim market seems to be pretty active. In the past the original selling price of parcels were calculated based on the cost of the sim. This was done to cover the original cost of the sim as soon as it was sold. With our current financial stability this is no longer necessary and between the original selling price and monthly tier I'm estimating we'd cover our initial investment within a few months. I haven't ran the numbers on this yet but since it is election time I wanted to let my thoughts be known.

Ever since I arrived I've been interested in seeing the CDS grow and prosper. I feel the more citizens we have the more representative of a democracy our community will become. However I don't agree that we need to limit the ownership of land any more than it is now. A lot of work and discussion went into the decision to set our restrictions where they are now and it was not a knee jerk reaction to any one situation or event.

Trebor Warcliffe

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Timo Gufler
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Timo Gufler »

Rosie Gray wrote:

Just so everyone is thinking about the map in the right way - NFS West would be the one that abutts NFS and Monastery, thus completing the rectangle of land. NFS EAST would be the one that adjoins only to NFS, and would be for extension of the city. :)

This is a good point, Rosie. NFS West isn't any more correct name than Monastery South or Alpine Meadow Southwest. ;) The theme, the topography and the population density of the new sim will be an interesting topic...

Image
The New Guild planning Monastery region in 2008

Last edited by Timo Gufler on Wed May 07, 2014 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ceasar Xigalia
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Ceasar Xigalia »

Callipygian wrote:

"The new sim seems to be the primary issue in this election period.

Imagine that NSF West is just finished, and it is the inaugural day to celebrate the new sim and allow people to buy properties there. There are 50 lots and 100 people, both old citizens and new people wanting to join CDS, lined up at the borders in Monastery and NSF waiting for the bell to rush in and buy properties -credit cards and Lindens in hand-.

What mechanism would you propose to guarantee the fair and equitable distribution of properties in the new sim?"

I propose a request based system for parcels. Any parcels that have more than one request being allocated by lottery. Anyone who is entered in a lottery who has yet to be awarded a parcel takes preference over a person who has already been awarded a parcel. Once everyone who requested a parcel has at least one parcel additional parcels can be distributed by the same allocation method. Any parcels left without a request are put on the open market when the sim is opened. All other extant land ownership laws would still apply.

It might assist this process if the RA were to codify the process for new Sim sales in law before a new sim is opened so that Citizens and potential Citizens can see that the process is fair and transparent.

Ceasar Xigalia,
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Cadence Theas
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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Cadence Theas »

Ceasar Xigalia wrote:

I propose a request based system for parcels. Any parcels that have more than one request being allocated by lottery. Anyone who is entered in a lottery who has yet to be awarded a parcel takes preference over a person who has already been awarded a parcel. Once everyone who requested a parcel has at least one parcel additional parcels can be distributed by the same allocation method. Any parcels left without a request are put on the open market when the sim is opened. All other extant land ownership laws would still apply.

It might assist this process if the RA were to codify the process for new Sim sales in law before a new sim is opened so that Citizens and potential Citizens can see that the process is fair and transparent.

I was going to give you + points for your suggestion which seems to follow the spirit of mine (not quite as far, but almost) and the idea of equity, but in this forum there are no points awarded. Anyway, your additional idea that this should be part of the legislation concerning the development of new sims is very important for the reasons you mentioned.

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Re: Question for candidates - chancellor and 21st RA -cadenc

Post by Patroklus Murakami »

I think new and current citizens should be treated equally with respect to a lottery along the lines that have been suggested here.

I am, frankly, shocked that a current RA member who claims to champion new citizens should adopt such an 'anti-immigrant' stance as to privilege existing citizens over newcomers. Why should we give first choice to current citizens when we have such a liquid land market with the Xigalias in particular acting as 'land flippers' for parcel after parcel to their friends and allies?

cleopatraxigalia wrote:

We have had the chancellor take a list of names of current citizens who desired specific parcels. When the sim was opened, the parcel is set for sale to the current citizen who asked for the parcel. If there is more than one person asking for certain properties then that has to be dealt with fairly of course, and hopefully openly. The rest of the land would then be put on the open market.

So, let's give the privilege to people who are already here and the newcomers can pick up the scraps if any are left? Truly shocking.

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