NG meeting - 12Feb2011 - Transcript

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Moon Adamant
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NG meeting - 12Feb2011 - Transcript

Post by Moon Adamant »

[9:19] Moon Adamant: ok...
[9:19] Moon Adamant: meeting of the NG of 12th Feb 2011
[9:19] Moon Adamant: please remember that the meeting will be transcripted
[9:19] Moon Adamant: the agenda - what there is of it - is in the red box
[9:19] Rosie Gray: Tor is coming
[9:19] Moon Adamant: only point: election of the NG secretary
[9:20] Rosie Gray: if you want to wait a minute
[9:20] Moon Adamant: as we wait for quorum, I will ask if any other topic for discussion
[9:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay for Mr. Chancellor!
[9:20] Moon Adamant: surely :)
[9:21] Pip Torok: well a talk as to what projects have been mooted or decided or what wd be nice ... for background
[9:21] Moon Adamant: hmmm
[9:21] Rosie Gray: oh yes
[9:21] Rosie Gray: hello Calli
[9:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: hello, Calli!
[9:21] Moon Adamant: hello Calli, nice to meet you :)
[9:21] Callipygian Christensen: Hi everyone
[9:21] Moon Adamant: hi Tor :)
[9:21] Callipygian Christensen: Hello Moon
[9:21] Pip Torok: ok ... as long as we know that
[9:21] Tor Karlsvalt: hi all
[9:22] Pip Torok: hi Calli, Tor
[9:22] Moon Adamant: no project, afaik, as been mooted
[9:22] Moon Adamant: ok, please remember that the meeting is transcripted
[9:22] Moon Adamant: and agenda is in teh red box - only one point so far, which is election of the Secretary of Board, but I was justly so asking for more points for it
[9:22] Gwyneth Llewelyn: and hi Tor!
[9:22] Moon Adamant: to answer Pip
[9:23] Moon Adamant: no project is mooted, because we are asked to project according to CDS needs
[9:23] Pip Torok: mmm
[9:23] Moon Adamant: so atm, we have one project running, which is Schloss
[9:24] Moon Adamant: possibly, if the CDS so decides, soon we may be asked to plan a new sim
[9:24] Moon Adamant: i know that there hs been discussion on that, but i do not know how the matter stands
[9:25] Moon Adamant: For Schloss, hopefully we will have a draft of final specs soon
[9:25] Moon Adamant: when we have that, the project can move on from its current discussion phase into a more concrete planning phase
[9:25] Tor Karlsvalt: We will work on that.
[9:26] Moon Adamant: yes
[9:26] Tor Karlsvalt: Guillaume has provided me some ideas.
[9:26] Pip Torok: has its placing been decided/confirmed yet?
[9:26] Tor Karlsvalt: i can pass them to you.
[9:26] Moon Adamant: you see that _we Guild_ do not know what are the needs of the CDS for the Schloss
[9:26] Tor Karlsvalt gave you Ideas for the NFS Schloss.
[9:27] Rosie Gray: thanks Tor
[9:27] Moon Adamant: oh very good
[9:27] Pip Torok: tks
[9:27] Moon Adamant: Tor, can I publish this in the forums as Specs?
[9:27] Gwyneth Llewelyn reads
[9:27] Tor Karlsvalt: This was Guillaums ideas. I asked the PIOs to provide their ideas based on the document proveded by the guild
[9:27] Moon Adamant: ah ok
[9:27] Moon Adamant: so we will wait for PIO input?
[9:28] Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh I love the mix of so different styles ㋡
[9:28] Tor Karlsvalt: um that was really not a final product
[9:28] Moon Adamant: or this doc has the input already?
[9:28] Moon Adamant: oh, ok
[9:28] Moon Adamant: send me it when you have it, please
[9:28] Tor Karlsvalt: yes I think that would work Gwyn
[9:28] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[9:28] Moon Adamant: we do have builders interested in the Schloss project
[9:28] Tor Karlsvalt: try to get eveyone together on this.
[9:28] Gwyneth Llewelyn: A Challenge for the Guild., but it might actually look nice at the end :)
[9:29] Moon Adamant: well, the builders are good builders :)
[9:29] Moon Adamant: ok, so to resume
[9:29] Moon Adamant: Schloss: specs in phase of darfting of final specs
[9:29] Moon Adamant: drafting*
[9:30] Moon Adamant: ok
[9:30] Moon Adamant: hmmm
[9:30] Rosie Gray: is there a prim allotment for it?
[9:30] Gwyneth Llewelyn: A veruy good question....
[9:30] Moon Adamant: Roise: less than the current schloss lol
[9:30] Rosie Gray: hahah
[9:30] Moon Adamant: really
[9:30] Tor Karlsvalt: does anyone know the prims of the schloss
[9:30] Rosie Gray: but no actual number decided?
[9:30] Rosie Gray: just wondering
[9:30] Moon Adamant: one issue detected some time ago is that the Schloss and the Rathaus take an enormous amount of prims
[9:31] Rosie Gray: yes they do!
[9:31] Moon Adamant: no, no actual number decided
[9:31] Pip Torok hopes the number of prims will do justice to the new build
[9:31] Moon Adamant: because hmmm
[9:31] Pip Torok: btw will the Schloss remain in situ?
[9:32] Moon Adamant: well, in the Schloss, we do really need to know the final specs so we have an idea of space so that we can define a prim limit
[9:32] Moon Adamant: for the Rathaus, I think the prims could be almost halved, maybe
[9:32] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, but by specs you mean what the CDS would need out of a schloss.
[9:32] Moon Adamant: the Schloss will remain in its parcel, Pip
[9:32] Moon Adamant: exactly
[9:33] Pip Torok: ah
[9:33] Rosie Gray: that podium thing n the Rathaus itself takes an amazing amount of prims
[9:33] Tor Karlsvalt: so not necessarily style but function.
[9:33] Moon Adamant: everything there takes an immense amount of prims!
[9:33] Rosie Gray nods
[9:33] Moon Adamant: well, Tor... easier for me at least to think prims in terms of function rather than style
[9:33] Moon Adamant: though i must make a note here
[9:34] Moon Adamant: buildings which try to recreate historical styles are always more primmy than modern builds
[9:34] Moon Adamant: from my experience
[9:34] Callipygian Christensen: since the Schloss is the showpiece of govt, it should be given whatever prims are needed to meet the spces, not the reverse :)
[9:34] Callipygian Christensen: specs
[9:34] Pip Torok agrees
[9:34] Moon Adamant: well, Calli, yes in theory
[9:35] Moon Adamant: but the issue is that was what happened :)
[9:35] Rosie Gray: I think in theory too, but it would be very easy to go overboard with out some guidelines
[9:35] Callipygian Christensen: of course.but building tech has come a long way
[9:35] Moon Adamant: i don't have the numbers here... but before CN a study was made on the allocation of prims to private and public functions
[9:36] Moon Adamant: and the percentage of prims for public (gov- managed spaces) in NFS
[9:36] Moon Adamant: was so high that the planning of CN demanded that public prim count would not surpass 10% of the sim's prims lol
[9:37] Moon Adamant: in any case
[9:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, I think that nFS is 30% or sometjing
[9:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: if not more
[9:37] Moon Adamant: we always have issues at the events in the NFS calendar
[9:37] Moon Adamant: because of lack of prims
[9:37] Tor Karlsvalt: wow
[9:37] Pip Torok: mmm ...
[9:38] Moon Adamant: if we can reduc primcount in the main prim spenders
[9:38] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, we solved Octoberfest thanks to Bromo
[9:38] Callipygian Christensen: it appears to be around 800 prims..does tahat sound right? inluding the clock tower?
[9:38] Moon Adamant: then organizing Oktoberfest, Winter holidays, etc will be easier
[9:38] Moon Adamant: maybe Calli
[9:38] Moon Adamant: dunno if only one parcel in the Schloss
[9:39] Pip Torok: does the football field soak up many prims?
[9:39] Moon Adamant: i don't know Pip
[9:39] Gwyneth Llewelyn: It doesn't *look* like that
[9:39] Moon Adamant: it wasn't done by the Guild, you see
[9:39] Gwyneth Llewelyn: BTW, as soon as LL release the new 64x64x64 prims, we can save a few there
[9:39] Gwyneth Llewelyn: oh... right, that's also possible right now
[9:40] Tor Karlsvalt: ys when is that happining?
[9:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (my chat is coming out of order, sorry)
[9:40] Rosie Gray: is there some problem with using megas?
[9:40] Moon Adamant: Calli: between 800 and 1000 prims
[9:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: March I think, Tor, butit's really anyone's guess
[9:40] Moon Adamant: it was supposed to happen last June :P
[9:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: They MIGHT be 'obsoleted', Rosie. A few mega-prims have disappeared recently
[9:40] Rosie Gray: hmmm...
[9:40] Pip Torok: that might be a source you see 9if there arent objections)
[9:41] Rosie Gray: I've heard of that, but also LL restoring them
[9:41] Moon Adamant: surely Rosie
[9:41] Moon Adamant: one issue we have at the Schloss is taht we do not own or can modify several of the prims/textures
[9:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
[9:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That' means... a new Shcloss
[9:42] Moon Adamant: that has limited the interventions on the Schloss... Samantha rebuilt parts of it some time ago, but there are bits that we can't modify
[9:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'd say, raze it, build from scratch :)
[9:42] Pip Torok: so we'll be stuck with the old-bits sine die?
[9:42] Tor Karlsvalt: I agree
[9:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: We can always return them, Pip
[9:42] Rosie Gray: I say raze it too
[9:42] Moon Adamant: no... if we rebuild, we can let them go
[9:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Exactly...
[9:43] Pip Torok: ah good
[9:43] Rosie Gray: it's unacceptable that it can't be adjusted
[9:43] Tor Karlsvalt: we can take some photos but many exist now
[9:43] Moon Adamant: and yes, the discussion on schloss has as premise that the schloss will be totally new
[9:43] Tor Karlsvalt: good
[9:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees
[9:43] Moon Adamant: Tor, a study of the Schloss was made some years ago
[9:43] Moon Adamant: for the record
[9:43] Pip Torok: silly question but will public buildings be owned by an "official" CDS alt?
[9:43] Moon Adamant: can't recall atm who did it... Sonja, I think
[9:44] Moon Adamant: that's not for us to decide :)
[9:44] Callipygian Christensen: that goes back to the content archivist Pip..and that still doesnt seem to be the case
[9:44] Rosie Gray: some public official needs to own it
[9:44] Tor Karlsvalt: Good question Pip, would it be easier if there was an alt master builder?
[9:44] Pip Torok: exactly
[9:44] Moon Adamant: technically the content archivist exists
[9:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: brb
[9:44] Moon Adamant: but there are issues
[9:44] Moon Adamant: i don't know which exactly
[9:45] Tor Karlsvalt: i don't think an alt was ever established per the law.
[9:45] Pip Torok: on the face of it yes.../ but imo second opinions from moon and sudane are essential
[9:45] Callipygian Christensen: its a paid position, but there doesnt actually seem to be a lot of content available when needed
[9:45] Callipygian Christensen: but tahts a different mater
[9:45] Tor Karlsvalt: I agree Calli
[9:45] Moon Adamant: ah calli
[9:45] Moon Adamant: that may happen because of another issue
[9:45] Rosie Gray: in my opinion, after a public building is created, it should be transferred full permissions to some official body
[9:45] Callipygian Christensen: so is there any predicted timeframe on the schloss project?
[9:45] Moon Adamant: it has always been my opinion
[9:45] Moon Adamant: that the work commissioned to the Guild must be paid
[9:46] Moon Adamant: even if only a token payment
[9:46] Callipygian Christensen: Rosie, that is what the content archivist should be for *nod*
[9:46] Rosie Gray nods
[9:46] Moon Adamant: for example, i have built stuff for the CDS, which i have sold for L41
[9:46] Tor Karlsvalt: I think tho the achivist only holds copies.
[9:46] Moon Adamant: L$1, sorry
[9:46] Tor Karlsvalt: at least that was the intent.
[9:46] Moon Adamant: but the token payment constitutes an exchange
[9:46] Callipygian Christensen nods to Moon
[9:46] Moon Adamant: and that clarifies the issue
[9:47] Moon Adamant: what is happening is that a lot of content wasn't done under the very clear contract that the Guild uses
[9:47] Moon Adamant: and so a lot of content is in a 'grey area'
[9:48] Moon Adamant: actually, the NG would like to clear all the stuff backwards
[9:48] Callipygian Christensen nods.for custom building I can see that Moon, yes -I think there is a lot of other 'content' relvant too, but its not a Guild matter so ill shut up :)
[9:48] Moon Adamant: in term sof builds, at least... we're always more vocated towards builds
[9:49] Moon Adamant: it could be a Guild matter Calli
[9:49] Moon Adamant: we never were able to assemble a team of content creators for stuff other than builds
[9:49] Moon Adamant: for example, we have very few scripters
[9:50] Rosie Gray: that's a shame
[9:50] Moon Adamant: well, scripters are rarer than modelers everywhere in SL
[9:50] Rosie Gray: they have their own priorities, I think
[9:50] Moon Adamant: for example, i can only script doors and stuff like that lol
[9:51] Rosie Gray: I have a friend who's a very accomplished scripter that I can call on
[9:51] Moon Adamant: and then there are some specialities in scripting which are even rarer
[9:51] Moon Adamant: like particles, for example
[9:51] Moon Adamant: but which are often needed for small content
[9:51] Moon Adamant: say, a fountain, a brook, etc
[9:51] Pip Torok wonders whether there is a "School for Scripters" ...
[9:52] Rosie Gray: I can do particle scripting
[9:52] Callipygian Christensen nods..so if we dont have our own, and purchase scritps, whatever - it should be prurchased by the content archivist alt and held as CDS property
[9:52] Moon Adamant: eheheh Rosie :) we will take note of that :)
[9:52] Tor Karlsvalt: Just to clarify the role of the CA:
[9:52] Tor Karlsvalt: A new civil service position, the Content Archivist (also referred to as "CA") is established. The CA is responsible for conserving and managing backup copies of public CDS content. Details of this are outlined in section C.

Limitations
2. The CA is prohibited from holding any other elected or appointed office in the sim government, unless a waiver is granted, on a case by case basis, by the SC.
3. The CA may not be in CDS land management groups.
[9:52] Rosie Gray: well Im no expert, lol
[9:53] Tor Karlsvalt: The CA has no role in managing build in the sim.
[9:54] Moon Adamant: Tor, I really don't know what are the issues with the CA in the light of that regulation
[9:54] Moon Adamant: i have passed my builds under the contract to the CA lol
[9:54] Moon Adamant: but i don't know what happens next :)
[9:55] Rosie Gray: does the CA change?
[9:55] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, I think she is supposed to keep copies, but perhaps we need an alt that will have access to the actual build in the sim.
[9:55] Tor Karlsvalt: no it has never changed.
[9:55] Moon Adamant: Rosie, I think maybe can change, but hasn't happened yet
[9:55] Rosie Gray: ah
[9:55] Pip Torok: my feeling is that we make the CA an alt -ASAP_...
[9:55] Callipygian Christensen: I dont think taht is necessary Tor..the CA just needs to be able to rez a build if needed, or any other content held
[9:55] Tor Karlsvalt: I agree pip
[9:55] Moon Adamant: in fact, taht regulation is omiss about the transfer of conetnet between CAs
[9:56] Rosie Gray: what about backing up all the major builds off grid?
[9:56] Callipygian Christensen: Pip, part of the payment to the CA *shoul* be to maintain a premium account imo, in the name of te CA alt
[9:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (back)
[9:56] Pip Torok: does LL provide such a backup facility?
[9:56] Moon Adamant: Pip, no
[9:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: No.
[9:56] Rosie Gray: but you can do it
[9:57] Pip Torok: ??
[9:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But builders can save their own content, so long as it hasn't been sold etc
[9:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Collaborative work cannot be copied.... well, not legally
[9:57] Rosie Gray: and as long as they have full permissions on everything in the build
[9:57] Tor Karlsvalt: that would be a major increase in the expense for the CA.
[9:57] Pip Torok: so if it were my property i cd rent a RAID or cloud system for the backup?
[9:57] Rosie Gray: what would be a major expense Tor?
[9:57] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, the actual build needs to be transferred to the CA not just a copy.
[9:58] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Also note that this mechanism doesn't copy scripts
[9:58] Tor Karlsvalt: A premium acct for the alt would be an expense.
[9:58] Pip Torok: :(
[9:58] Moon Adamant: guys... I am sorry
[9:58] Rosie Gray: correct Gwyn! It's not an easy process
[9:58] Moon Adamant: but one hour has passed
[9:58] Moon Adamant: and we have the election to do
[9:58] Callipygian Christensen: 6$ US a month - to hold a lot of valuable content..seems reasonable
[9:58] Rosie Gray: sorry Moon
[9:59] Moon Adamant: also another point of teh agenda that Tor recalled me about
[9:59] Pip Torok: /m agrees with Calli
[9:59] Rosie Gray agrees with Calli too
[9:59] Moon Adamant: so if you will excuse me
[9:59] Moon Adamant: i will bring the meeting back to agenda :)
[9:59] Moon Adamant: ok
[9:59] Moon Adamant: election of the NG Secretary of the Board
[10:00] Callipygian Christensen: and access to the alt could be available to the chancellor or a ra member..without compromising the CA's personal account
[10:00] Moon Adamant: as you know
[10:00] Moon Adamant: this election should have followed the general election
[10:00] Moon Adamant: but teh previous meeting didn't have quorum
[10:00] Moon Adamant: we now do
[10:00] Moon Adamant: and so i propose that we pass staright to it
[10:01] Moon Adamant: i called the election on teh forums, asking for candidates to apply by answering the post
[10:01] Moon Adamant: at
[10:01] Moon Adamant: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=3410
[10:02] Moon Adamant: as you can see, people stampeded in :P
[10:02] Callipygian Christensen: haha
[10:02] Tor Karlsvalt: :)
[10:02] Rosie Gray grins
[10:02] Pip Torok: :)
[10:02] Moon Adamant: I will call again for candidates among those present
[10:02] Moon Adamant: anyone?
[10:02] Tor Karlsvalt looks around at all the eager faces.
[10:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn notices the crowd cheering
[10:03] Moon Adamant: another stampede :)
[10:03] Rosie Gray listens to the roaring silence
[10:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ooooh "roaring silence" — I love that!
[10:03] Rosie Gray: someday I will have time to do things like this!
[10:03] Moon Adamant: oh, btw, Sudane has asked me to put her vote in, as she couldn't make the meeting
[10:03] Moon Adamant: ok
[10:04] Moon Adamant: so apparently the incumbent is the only victim er candidate :)
[10:04] Tor Karlsvalt: I don't think i can even vote here. soo
[10:04] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:04] Moon Adamant: i am going to give you all a LAST chance while i look for Sudane's mail lol
[10:04] Moon Adamant: Tor, you can, you're a citizen
[10:05] Moon Adamant: ok...
[10:06] Moon Adamant: calling for the election of the Secretary of the Board of the New Guild
[10:06] Moon Adamant: only candidate is Moon Adamant
[10:06] Moon Adamant: if you agree that she keeps the role of Secretary, please say Aye
[10:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye :)
[10:06] Pip Torok: Aye
[10:07] Callipygian Christensen: yay Moon! aye!
[10:07] Moon Adamant: Rosie, Tor
[10:07] Rosie Gray: Aye
[10:07] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[10:07] Moon Adamant: ok
[10:07] Moon Adamant: Sudane's vote, copying from her mail to me:
[10:08] Moon Adamant: "But if I may convey to you my proxy intentions... I vote for you for leader "
[10:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ㋡
[10:08] Moon Adamant: so another aye
[10:08] Moon Adamant: and I abstain
[10:08] Tor Karlsvalt: :)
[10:08] Moon Adamant: motion carried
[10:08] Rosie Gray: yay!
[10:08] Moon Adamant: thanks everyone
[10:08] Pip Torok: congratulations!
[10:08] Moon Adamant: eheheh
[10:08] Moon Adamant: I am feeling some deja vue
[10:09] Moon Adamant: but i must thank you all for the trust
[10:09] Moon Adamant: so thank you all :)
[10:09] Moon Adamant: Now
[10:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Brava, Moon :) congrats (lol)!
[10:09] Moon Adamant: next to the election of the Secreatry
[10:09] Moon Adamant: there should happen the election of the heads of department
[10:10] Moon Adamant: admin and financial
[10:10] Moon Adamant: but i have to postpone that
[10:10] Moon Adamant: as I couldn't ascertain willingness to remain of one of teh incumbents
[10:10] Moon Adamant: (translating: haven't seen her online lol)
[10:10] Moon Adamant: so we will pass that to next meeting
[10:11] Moon Adamant: ok
[10:11] Moon Adamant: another point which should be in agenda and isn't
[10:11] Moon Adamant: my fault there... I couldn't recall it
[10:11] Moon Adamant: is that we have a question
[10:12] Moon Adamant: could we fill in the sides of NFS that create visual gaps when looking from teh other sims?
[10:12] Moon Adamant: I actually do not know
[10:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Fill the gaps.... with more sims? :)
[10:12] Rosie Gray: does that mean the undersides of the sims?
[10:12] Moon Adamant: no lol
[10:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
[10:12] Moon Adamant: the sides
[10:12] Pip Torok: but its exposed on two sides!
[10:12] Callipygian Christensen: Rosie..the schloss side that just hangs in midair like magic
[10:13] Moon Adamant: yes, possibly we'd have to fill two sides
[10:13] Rosie Gray: yes, heheh
[10:13] Pip Torok: sorry ... three!
[10:13] Callipygian Christensen: not sure if the back side is visible to other sims or not
[10:13] Rosie Gray: are adjacent sims requesting that?
[10:13] Moon Adamant: this would be something temporary until we managed to make sims enough to go down to the water level, of course
[10:13] Rosie Gray thinks that it is indeed an eyesore
[10:13] Pip Torok: but wdnt there be an inordinate cost?
[10:14] Moon Adamant: I can't recall who requested that
[10:14] Pip Torok: inordinate
[10:14] Callipygian Christensen: the likelihood of a sim on the schloss side is small I would guess
[10:14] Moon Adamant: sorry... I have a health condition which makes the short to medium-term memory be a bit faulty
[10:14] Tor Karlsvalt: Perhaps a screen could be created?
[10:14] Gwyneth Llewelyn: can we just place megaprims on the sides? (I'm just wildly brainstorming, I don't know if megaprims would be visible from a distance or not)
[10:14] Moon Adamant: well, I think maybe two solutions would be possible
[10:14] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
[10:15] Callipygian Christensen: if they have a pretty mountainside texture Gwyn, sure
[10:15] Moon Adamant: 1. place megaprims and prims to make a screen, as Tor and Gwyn are suggesting
[10:15] Rosie Gray: it's possible to stretch the terraform down to the edge, but a lot of work
[10:15] Pip Torok: the question shd be ... will the "complainer " be satisfied with our solution ....
[10:15] Moon Adamant: 2. make a sculpty that would 'fill' in the gap
[10:15] Callipygian Christensen: she's sitting hee Pip..so willprobably comment if needed :)
[10:16] Moon Adamant: I don't know if 2 is possible
[10:16] Pip Torok: ah!
[10:16] Moon Adamant: i know that it is possible to create a sculpty map from a sim .raw file
[10:16] Rosie Gray: wouldn't a sculpty that big just distort terribly?
[10:16] Callipygian Christensen: Rosie..i think terraforming would disitrot those parcels on the precipice
[10:16] Moon Adamant: but i do not know if when applied to a 256*256*256 cube
[10:16] Moon Adamant: if it will work
[10:17] Rosie Gray: well you can do it Calli, without distorting much... but it's not easy
[10:17] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Terraforming would give us very ugly things...
[10:17] Moon Adamant: there is an issue of very few pixels in the sculpty map for such wide dimensions... it could look clumsy
[10:17] Rosie Gray: lol, I'm not advocating we do it
[10:17] Moon Adamant: i can ask though from a sculpty expert
[10:18] Tor Karlsvalt: or just add the sims :)
[10:18] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:18] Moon Adamant: well, yes, but that can take tiome lol
[10:18] Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Tor's suggestion :)
[10:18] Moon Adamant: if you look at the maps above me
[10:18] Rosie Gray thirds Tor's suggestion
[10:18] Tor Karlsvalt: could we upgrade void sims?
[10:18] Tor Karlsvalt: if we wanted too later?
[10:19] Moon Adamant: you'll see that you need at least one sim on each side to go down to water level,.and those sims will have at least the slope of AM
[10:19] Moon Adamant: dunno Tor... you could obviously place full sims instead of teh voids
[10:19] Moon Adamant: and pass the raw file from one to the other
[10:20] Tor Karlsvalt: that would abutt Garnata.
[10:20] Callipygian Christensen: has anyone checked to see if LL will require the permission of AA to place a sim there?
[10:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmh!
[10:20] Moon Adamant: no
[10:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hm hm.
[10:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
[10:20] Moon Adamant: well, at least I haven't lol
[10:20] Rosie Gray: good question
[10:20] Tor Karlsvalt: No we could ask.
[10:20] Tor Karlsvalt: I suppose Rudeen would have to ask.
[10:21] Tor Karlsvalt: Does LL talk to anyone not recognized as the EO?
[10:21] Moon Adamant: no
[10:21] Moon Adamant: but i think Rudeen can ask that
[10:22] Moon Adamant: it's a pity Sudane isn't here, because she could answer all those questions
[10:22] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Calli is also right hehe
[10:22] Callipygian Christensen: really we are talking 2 sims..abutting alpine meadow and NFS..hard to do one without the other?
[10:22] Tor Karlsvalt: That would add two sims tho. expensive and we would need RA approval.
[10:23] Moon Adamant: well, Calli
[10:23] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Squeezing money out of the RA, mmmh :)
[10:23] Moon Adamant: the issue is a long-standing one
[10:23] Gwyneth Llewelyn winks @ Tor
[10:23] Moon Adamant: hmmm
[10:23] Moon Adamant: let me try and put it briefly
[10:23] Moon Adamant: the plans above me
[10:23] Moon Adamant: made two years ago
[10:24] Moon Adamant: were made according to requests for having a very developed alpine zone
[10:24] Moon Adamant: higher than NFS on sims 26 and 32
[10:24] Tor Karlsvalt: We do alpine very well.
[10:24] Moon Adamant: or thereabouts :)
[10:24] Rosie Gray: brb
[10:25] Moon Adamant: considering that the AM slope is about the maximum slope you can have while keeping some versatility about parcel size
[10:25] Moon Adamant: or about 25% inclination
[10:25] Moon Adamant: you'd need all those sims to bring every thing down to water level
[10:25] Tor Karlsvalt: it could end in a very attactve cliff
[10:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Like on the Monastery....
[10:26] Moon Adamant: possibly lol
[10:26] Moon Adamant: but i do not decide stuff on my own
[10:26] Tor Karlsvalt: maybe an isolated beach and cliffs.
[10:26] Moon Adamant: so we have the question atm: do we really want all these sims?
[10:26] Callipygian Christensen nods..the current reality though is that aquiring the sims to complete that is unlikely I'd think
[10:26] Moon Adamant: that's one question
[10:26] Tor Karlsvalt: so back to the screen?
[10:26] Moon Adamant: the second question is
[10:27] Moon Adamant: NFS need stwo very special neighbour sims on both east and west
[10:27] Tor Karlsvalt: well we all seem to want a new seem but afaid to jump on it.
[10:27] Moon Adamant: east, because the city must continue somehow
[10:27] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Tor, that's the history of the CDS :) It's always been like that hehe
[10:27] Moon Adamant: and west, because the hill on the west is actually the highest point in NFS
[10:28] Moon Adamant: seeing we have a grand bridge spamming the central valley
[10:28] Moon Adamant: it was always felt that the bridge should lead 'somewhere'
[10:28] Moon Adamant: so the West sim needs to be that 'somewhere'
[10:28] Moon Adamant: see what I mean?
[10:28] Pip Torok: yes
[10:29] Moon Adamant: when proposing the alpine sims
[10:29] Moon Adamant: the somewhere was more or less solved
[10:29] Moon Adamant: as they would be higher
[10:29] Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh-huh
[10:30] Moon Adamant: if the west sim continues to be the highest point, then it must have a 'somewhere'
[10:30] Moon Adamant: ideas have been issued about ski tracks, etc
[10:30] Moon Adamant: maybe a hamlet-ish on top of a plateau
[10:30] Tor Karlsvalt: there is interest for an airport.
[10:31] Rosie Gray: back
[10:31] Rosie Gray: what happened to the idea of a sandbox? I still think that would be a great draw
[10:31] Moon Adamant: hmmm, it may need so much area that we may not have enough land left to do a comfy slope for building
[10:32] Tor Karlsvalt: I think the idea is for a vintage early 20th century airport.
[10:32] Moon Adamant: hmmm sandbox is new for me
[10:32] Rosie Gray: that would be so fun Tor
[10:32] Tor Karlsvalt: sanbox too in a clearcut.
[10:32] Moon Adamant: i would place that in an island of its own
[10:32] Pip Torok: even if the build were somehow "snuggled" into the slope?..
[10:32] Moon Adamant: void sim possibly
[10:32] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Weren't we doing an airport too? (Guillaume's idea)
[10:32] Rosie Gray: I would just put it up in the sky, and wilderness below
[10:33] Moon Adamant: Rosie, issue there is
[10:33] Tor Karlsvalt: haha, Guillaume has a plan for sims already.
[10:33] Moon Adamant: sims must pay for themselves
[10:33] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, that is the money issue
[10:33] Rosie Gray: Guill has so many ideas hehehe
[10:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I've heard, Tor, and he told me just a little bit about it
[10:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah yes, that's true, Rosie :D
[10:33] Pip Torok wonders whether RL airports that height wdnt be dangerous
[10:33] Tor Karlsvalt: we have always required that the sims fund their own building.
[10:33] Moon Adamant: unless there is a clear indication from the RA that we can have sims for 'landscape' purposes
[10:34] Moon Adamant: this has been discussed... we always concluded that even when using voids, costs should be carefully evaluated
[10:34] Tor Karlsvalt: Well an airport would give us a new activity and access to a new group of people.
[10:34] Moon Adamant: we... they :)
[10:34] Gwyneth Llewelyn: You sound like Gui, Tor :)
[10:35] Moon Adamant: thinking
[10:35] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But.... I'm not disagreeing....
[10:35] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[10:35] Moon Adamant: IF we put an airport on sim 27
[10:35] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yay, Moon is even considering it!=
[10:35] Moon Adamant: then we will need almost for sure to build sim 26
[10:35] Moon Adamant: unless we decide to have a cliff
[10:35] Moon Adamant: mind you
[10:36] Moon Adamant: cliff can be temporary
[10:36] Moon Adamant: and if we ever need to place a sim 26... we can build it
[10:36] Rosie Gray loves the idea of a vintage airport
[10:36] Tor Karlsvalt: I know guil wants to move in that direction, but could we move to sim 30? or 24?
[10:36] Moon Adamant: we will just need to make sure that in sim 27 we do a road that can access an eventual sim 26, you see
[10:37] Moon Adamant: i wouldn't place it on sim 30
[10:37] Moon Adamant: because we need to expand the city in that sim
[10:37] Moon Adamant: or it will look odd
[10:37] Moon Adamant: to have a sudenly straight wall
[10:38] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, maybe 24?
[10:38] Moon Adamant: 24 is a slope sim
[10:38] Moon Adamant: meaning
[10:38] Moon Adamant: it has the same slope as AM
[10:38] Moon Adamant: can we fit the airport there?
[10:38] Moon Adamant: we did have huge parcels which were flattish in AM
[10:38] Moon Adamant: i can't answer that question precisely, you see
[10:39] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, wel don't discount it. I think Guil's idea might have been for an airport with a difficult take off. A mountain airport.
[10:39] Moon Adamant: because i do not know how much space does it take
[10:39] Moon Adamant: for example
[10:39] Moon Adamant: at a project i am working on at this moment
[10:39] Moon Adamant: also a city
[10:39] Moon Adamant: we do have an airport and the beginning of the air strip
[10:40] Moon Adamant: let me see how long it is... just a sec
[10:40] Moon Adamant: so about 120 m
[10:40] Moon Adamant: half the side of a sim
[10:41] Moon Adamant: what happens there is that it looks incomplete
[10:41] Moon Adamant: maybe because we have big modern planes
[10:41] Moon Adamant: so obviously they wouldn't be able to land on that strip
[10:42] Moon Adamant: now, what i think should be done is
[10:42] Moon Adamant: get a couple of biplanes, etc
[10:42] Moon Adamant: and see how long a strip should be so they could land on it
[10:42] Moon Adamant: that would be our base for planning
[10:43] Rosie Gray: Guillaume has a couple of planes
[10:43] Moon Adamant: ok
[10:43] Moon Adamant: so what I suggest is
[10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Quite nice ones too 8I've tested some! hehe )
[10:43] Moon Adamant: make that test
[10:43] Moon Adamant: so we know how much space we need for the airport
[10:43] Tor Karlsvalt: I am sure he will be reading the transcript
[10:43] Moon Adamant: then we can start planning
[10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: He'll be giving medals to Moon
[10:43] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[10:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :)
[10:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Just because she's taking him seriously!
[10:44] Moon Adamant: namely, we can see how much land we have left for building so the sim pays itself
[10:44] Rosie Gray: heheh
[10:44] Moon Adamant: and why not lol?
[10:44] Moon Adamant: it's an interesting idea
[10:44] Tor Karlsvalt: Well this would provide new sims with a market and purpose as well as solve our open side issue.
[10:44] Rosie Gray: could be a nice draw to the group
[10:44] Pip Torok agrees
[10:45] Moon Adamant: and please don't forget that Kendra's original vision for NFS is that it would be a modernist hmmm moment in a far older city
[10:45] Rosie Gray: I do like that vision!
[10:45] Tor Karlsvalt: yes i agree, Moon
[10:45] Moon Adamant: ok
[10:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: For what's worth, I totally agree too :)
[10:45] Moon Adamant: i need to leave in 15 mins
[10:45] Callipygian Christensen: Tor..taht solves the open side issue a year or more from now..so if it isn't unreasonable, could we go back a moment to what to do now to make it less butt ugly? :)
[10:45] Tor Karlsvalt: We don't have to be stuck in the past, just respectful of it.
[10:45] Moon Adamant: so i think we are more or less in agreement
[10:46] Tor Karlsvalt: In short term we should work on a screen.
[10:46] Moon Adamant: we will need to know the space the airport will take
[10:46] Rosie Gray: a few megas could be a screen
[10:46] Moon Adamant: so I will ask Guillaume and you guys to please put some planes on and see how much strip they need
[10:47] Tor Karlsvalt: Moon, could we have someone work on the temp screen or sculpty?
[10:47] Moon Adamant: then we can look at the terrain after that
[10:47] Moon Adamant: surely
[10:47] Moon Adamant: anyone volunteers?
[10:47] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[10:47] Rosie Gray: hahah
[10:47] Rosie Gray: well I can do that, if you want
[10:47] Moon Adamant: of course lol
[10:47] Moon Adamant: thanks :)
[10:47] Rosie Gray: welcome
[10:47] Moon Adamant: hmmmmm
[10:48] Tor Karlsvalt: if money is needed maybe RA can take up some funding.
[10:48] Moon Adamant: maybe you will need to work with sudane on that
[10:48] Tor Karlsvalt: I can propose that.
[10:48] Rosie Gray: but someone needs to tell me exactly which sides we are talking about
[10:48] Tor Karlsvalt: the side under the wall side.
[10:48] Moon Adamant: because i don't know if the sides are all public terrain or parcelled, you see
[10:48] Moon Adamant: let me see
[10:48] Rosie Gray nods
[10:49] Tor Karlsvalt: and other parcels in AM
[10:49] Callipygian Christensen: the east side of NFS and Alpine meadow
[10:49] Moon Adamant: about money
[10:49] Moon Adamant: This should be a project funded by the RA
[10:49] Moon Adamant: so Rosie
[10:49] Tor Karlsvalt: i suppose some money might be needed if you have to upload textures.
[10:49] Moon Adamant: yes
[10:49] Moon Adamant: please make a budget
[10:50] Tor Karlsvalt: right
[10:50] Moon Adamant: and we will present that to the RA
[10:50] Rosie Gray: okay... budget: $100L
[10:50] Moon Adamant: lol, ask more
[10:50] Rosie Gray: okay, $2,000L
[10:50] Rosie Gray: hahah
[10:50] Moon Adamant: now really, you'll have textures to upload
[10:51] Moon Adamant: whatever you find right
[10:51] Tor Karlsvalt the treasury mice shiver over loosing their gold.
[10:51] Pip Torok: :)
[10:51] Moon Adamant: also consider the time you'll spend, and that should be reckoned as well
[10:51] Rosie Gray: I always have a hard time with that
[10:51] Pip Torok agrees strongly
[10:51] Rosie Gray: couldn't possibly pay me RL money
[10:51] Moon Adamant: there's moths raising big families in the treasury :)
[10:51] Rosie Gray: hmmm...
[10:52] Rosie Gray: okay well let me think on that then
[10:52] Moon Adamant: surely
[10:52] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[10:53] Moon Adamant: ok... i have les sthan 10 mins
[10:53] Moon Adamant: any other business?
[10:53] Tor Karlsvalt: oh I should mention we have another request some time ago
[10:54] Tor Karlsvalt: Alexia is/was interested in an island of her own for her business.
[10:54] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh? :)
[10:54] Tor Karlsvalt: but we can table this for later.
[10:54] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Build by the Guild? :)
[10:54] Moon Adamant: ah yes
[10:54] Tor Karlsvalt: Well I think the law 8-4 involves the guild and chancellor
[10:55] Tor Karlsvalt: naturally with RA approval.
[10:55] Moon Adamant: we Guild need to give her indications on terrain according to GMP and possibly covenant
[10:55] Tor Karlsvalt: essentially tho Alexia would build the sim to the NG guidlines pr parameters
[10:55] Moon Adamant: but I will need to re-read that law
[10:55] Tor Karlsvalt: right
[10:56] Moon Adamant: also refresh my memory about Monastery, which was a similar case, maybe?
[10:56] Tor Karlsvalt: and frankly i need to make sure she is still interested.
[10:56] Tor Karlsvalt: just want to be out on the table tho.
[10:56] Moon Adamant: Alexia will need to present a sim plan
[10:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes.
[10:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: some specs
[10:56] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, agree
[10:57] Tor Karlsvalt: I think she is thinkig of an island off LA
[10:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: overall look is Alpine, so that's easy
[10:57] Moon Adamant: i'll review the Monastery process to see how that was managed
[10:57] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[10:57] Moon Adamant: in any case
[10:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I mean, we have covenants for that :) )
[10:57] Rosie Gray: I don't really understand the status of Monastery
[10:57] Moon Adamant: and alomost for sure
[10:57] Rosie Gray: :P
[10:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn thinks that the Monastery is a good prcedent
[10:57] Tor Karlsvalt: Well I will ask Alexia to devise a plan.
[10:57] Moon Adamant: ok, thanks Tor
[10:57] Tor Karlsvalt: she also needs a plan for aquiring the sim.
[10:58] Tor Karlsvalt: esentially i favor the second method in the law.
[10:58] Moon Adamant: please tell her that I will be reviewing the processes that may be precedent
[10:58] Tor Karlsvalt: but that isn't guild stuff.
[10:58] Moon Adamant: uh, money is not my department lol
[10:58] Moon Adamant: you want Sudane there
[10:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway... this was productive today hehe
[10:59] Moon Adamant: ok guys
[10:59] Moon Adamant: yes, very productive
[10:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I'm afraid we should finish now...
[10:59] Tor Karlsvalt: ok and we will get the specs too
[10:59] Moon Adamant: i will try to hold another meeting next saturday, maybe
[10:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay :)
[10:59] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[10:59] Tor Karlsvalt: next sat is good for me
[10:59] Moon Adamant: let me check my agenda to see if anything already scheduled
[10:59] Moon Adamant: just a sec
[11:00] Moon Adamant: ok, I am free
[11:00] Moon Adamant: let me put it in the clendar!
[11:00] Tor Karlsvalt: :)
[11:00] Moon Adamant: ok guys
[11:01] Moon Adamant: thank you all
[11:01] Moon Adamant: this was very productive indeed :)
[11:01] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[11:01] Rosie Gray: what time next saturday Moon?
[11:01] Moon Adamant: i will close the transcript now
[11:01] Moon Adamant: this time, 9 AM SLT

Eudaimonia now!
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